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	<title>Comments on: Has the expiry date on Agile just been set?</title>
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	<link>http://nutrun.com/weblog/has-the-expiry-date-on-agile-just-been-set/</link>
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	<pubDate>Tue, 07 Oct 2008 14:11:20 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Dave Nicolette</title>
		<link>http://nutrun.com/weblog/has-the-expiry-date-on-agile-just-been-set/#comment-92</link>
		<dc:creator>Dave Nicolette</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Aug 2006 11:47:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://new-site.nutrun.com/?p=22#comment-92</guid>
		<description>The pattern you're seeing as more companies adopt "agile" this-and-that is a familiar one. Seems like every new idea or new technology that comes down the pike goes through the same stages of adoption.

There are enthusiastic early adopters willing to try the New Thing based on what its description appears to promise. If early results are promising, then the adoption rate rises. The so-called "early majority pragmatists" pick up the New Thing on the basis of anecdotal succes stories.

Right about then, vendors, consultants, and pundits start to re-craft their marketing material around the newly popular buzzword. That's when things start to get confusing. IMO that's where the industry is right now with respect to "agile".

Regarding the distinction between agile and lean, I agree with the statement made by commenter "Deb" above. Mechanically or procedurally, agile and lean are largely the same. It's the relative emphasis on process vs people that makes the difference, and a very subtle difference it may be.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The pattern you&#8217;re seeing as more companies adopt &#8220;agile&#8221; this-and-that is a familiar one. Seems like every new idea or new technology that comes down the pike goes through the same stages of adoption.</p>
<p>There are enthusiastic early adopters willing to try the New Thing based on what its description appears to promise. If early results are promising, then the adoption rate rises. The so-called &#8220;early majority pragmatists&#8221; pick up the New Thing on the basis of anecdotal succes stories.</p>
<p>Right about then, vendors, consultants, and pundits start to re-craft their marketing material around the newly popular buzzword. That&#8217;s when things start to get confusing. IMO that&#8217;s where the industry is right now with respect to &#8220;agile&#8221;.</p>
<p>Regarding the distinction between agile and lean, I agree with the statement made by commenter &#8220;Deb&#8221; above. Mechanically or procedurally, agile and lean are largely the same. It&#8217;s the relative emphasis on process vs people that makes the difference, and a very subtle difference it may be.</p>
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		<title>By: Kevin Brady</title>
		<link>http://nutrun.com/weblog/has-the-expiry-date-on-agile-just-been-set/#comment-91</link>
		<dc:creator>Kevin Brady</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Aug 2006 08:57:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://new-site.nutrun.com/?p=22#comment-91</guid>
		<description>At last another person who is looking at AGILE in a sensible pragmatic way and putting the methid into its proper perspective and place in the tool box. If you talk to the bunch of people above they will tell you that AGILE can just about do anything from IT project to building your house and I am sure next rockets to the moon. You are indeed right AGILE is a REAL Project Managers nightmare especially as Ken Schwaber say's Project Managers are facilitiers but have responsibility for the project - sounds like being responsbile for speeding fines when someone else is  driving your car - Great Job !! Thanks - What TWAT's going to take on the role of what is essentially team support person. Your not going to get the best and brightest to take up that role. For god sack Project Management is in a sorry enough state as it is with untrained, low integrety and weak project management only to make things worse with AGILE and SCRUM. Your also right about the FEES being the big motivator with all this hype. I really hope that AGILE has reached its expire date !! Please read some of my articles on AGILE :-

AGILE Fees Feeding Frenzy - http://www.claretyconsulting.com/it/comments/agile-fees-feeding-frenzy/2006-07-27/

AGILE Enough is Enough -
http://www.claretyconsulting.com/it/comments/agile-enough-is-enough/2006-06-26/

Before I go I want to say that AGILE is not all bad it is just gone to far and is causing more harm than good from recent troublshooting experience.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>At last another person who is looking at AGILE in a sensible pragmatic way and putting the methid into its proper perspective and place in the tool box. If you talk to the bunch of people above they will tell you that AGILE can just about do anything from IT project to building your house and I am sure next rockets to the moon. You are indeed right AGILE is a REAL Project Managers nightmare especially as Ken Schwaber say&#8217;s Project Managers are facilitiers but have responsibility for the project - sounds like being responsbile for speeding fines when someone else is  driving your car - Great Job !! Thanks - What TWAT&#8217;s going to take on the role of what is essentially team support person. Your not going to get the best and brightest to take up that role. For god sack Project Management is in a sorry enough state as it is with untrained, low integrety and weak project management only to make things worse with AGILE and SCRUM. Your also right about the FEES being the big motivator with all this hype. I really hope that AGILE has reached its expire date !! Please read some of my articles on AGILE :-</p>
<p>AGILE Fees Feeding Frenzy - <a href="http://www.claretyconsulting.com/it/comments/agile-fees-feeding-frenzy/2006-07-27/" rel="nofollow">http://www.claretyconsulting.com/it/comments/agile-fees-feeding-frenzy/2006-07-27/</a></p>
<p>AGILE Enough is Enough -<br />
<a href="http://www.claretyconsulting.com/it/comments/agile-enough-is-enough/2006-06-26/" rel="nofollow">http://www.claretyconsulting.com/it/comments/agile-enough-is-enough/2006-06-26/</a></p>
<p>Before I go I want to say that AGILE is not all bad it is just gone to far and is causing more harm than good from recent troublshooting experience.</p>
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		<title>By: Brian</title>
		<link>http://nutrun.com/weblog/has-the-expiry-date-on-agile-just-been-set/#comment-90</link>
		<dc:creator>Brian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Aug 2006 18:53:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://new-site.nutrun.com/?p=22#comment-90</guid>
		<description>Focus on people, not process -- hmm.  Focus on people, not technology -- bigger hmm.  If we had employed Agile, TDD, blah-blah-blah methods to getting people on the moon, we'd still be iteratively attempting to determine the correct size of the recovery shute . . . Let the  VB, App hacking woe-is-me 20 somethings play with Agile and leave the system developers to the engineers.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Focus on people, not process &#8212; hmm.  Focus on people, not technology &#8212; bigger hmm.  If we had employed Agile, TDD, blah-blah-blah methods to getting people on the moon, we&#8217;d still be iteratively attempting to determine the correct size of the recovery shute . . . Let the  VB, App hacking woe-is-me 20 somethings play with Agile and leave the system developers to the engineers.</p>
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		<title>By: Sancho</title>
		<link>http://nutrun.com/weblog/has-the-expiry-date-on-agile-just-been-set/#comment-89</link>
		<dc:creator>Sancho</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 15 Jul 2006 00:56:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://new-site.nutrun.com/?p=22#comment-89</guid>
		<description>Agile and Lean are really quite different paradigms.

Lean empowers survival when resources are scarce; the ascetic who lives by the river and eats mud can obviously get by on very little, however, there may little tangible action to show for this methodolgy, rather it's the spiritual synergy that empowers this enterprise.

Agile, on the other hand, focuses like a laser beam on constant action-based improvement, while deemphasizing the need to pause and reflect on the consequences of each decision. That's where the importance of leadership emerges as a disruptive force.

Neither one of these frameworks implies an ability to lift heavy things or actually get anything done.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Agile and Lean are really quite different paradigms.</p>
<p>Lean empowers survival when resources are scarce; the ascetic who lives by the river and eats mud can obviously get by on very little, however, there may little tangible action to show for this methodolgy, rather it&#8217;s the spiritual synergy that empowers this enterprise.</p>
<p>Agile, on the other hand, focuses like a laser beam on constant action-based improvement, while deemphasizing the need to pause and reflect on the consequences of each decision. That&#8217;s where the importance of leadership emerges as a disruptive force.</p>
<p>Neither one of these frameworks implies an ability to lift heavy things or actually get anything done.</p>
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		<title>By: Juan Bernabó</title>
		<link>http://nutrun.com/weblog/has-the-expiry-date-on-agile-just-been-set/#comment-88</link>
		<dc:creator>Juan Bernabó</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 05 Jul 2006 14:34:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://new-site.nutrun.com/?p=22#comment-88</guid>
		<description>I think the talk on process is great, but we are missing the fundamentals, it's not about Agile, XP, RUP, Scrum, Waterfall.

The essential thing that I can see on this "new" processes is a shift on the focus from technology oriented processes to people oriented processes.

When we put People at the center, not minds or hands alone, we are recognizing what software development is a highly knowledge oriented activity, as far as I know the most adapted tool for transforming, relating and producing new knowledge is People.

All this new processes are more people focused, this gives them the edge, are better aligned with the real needs of a people intensive production system.

In my company balance sheet, I have a column where says "Assets", there are listed the chairs, computers, tools, etc. that make up the software development department.  From this, Industrial age, view of the economics of a company People are expenses not "Assets".
Anybody with a little more understanding on software development and how it works, can tell that the rigth culture, with the rigth people, that may learn, and adapt its work to the more effective process, and tools and practices, this are the real "Assets".

What i'm trying to say here is we are experiencing is a paradigm shift, one from the Industrial age to the Knowledge age, wich is creating a lot of conflicts as systems are becoming obsolete, like on the process side upfront vs. more agile, management vs. leadership, etc.

The agile movement is one subset of the bigger scene of changes that we will be experiencing, and this won't cease, as more and more companies, groups of people, start understanding the fundamentals of this paradigm shift, and embracing it, we will see a massive adoption of more people focused processes and systems, the economics simply will do its job, and maybe yes we will need to wait until some of the grayed guys leave, or until we may influence them, slowly but constantly.

On the end is really about anything that allow us to do be effective on developing software that adds value.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think the talk on process is great, but we are missing the fundamentals, it&#8217;s not about Agile, XP, RUP, Scrum, Waterfall.</p>
<p>The essential thing that I can see on this &#8220;new&#8221; processes is a shift on the focus from technology oriented processes to people oriented processes.</p>
<p>When we put People at the center, not minds or hands alone, we are recognizing what software development is a highly knowledge oriented activity, as far as I know the most adapted tool for transforming, relating and producing new knowledge is People.</p>
<p>All this new processes are more people focused, this gives them the edge, are better aligned with the real needs of a people intensive production system.</p>
<p>In my company balance sheet, I have a column where says &#8220;Assets&#8221;, there are listed the chairs, computers, tools, etc. that make up the software development department.  From this, Industrial age, view of the economics of a company People are expenses not &#8220;Assets&#8221;.<br />
Anybody with a little more understanding on software development and how it works, can tell that the rigth culture, with the rigth people, that may learn, and adapt its work to the more effective process, and tools and practices, this are the real &#8220;Assets&#8221;.</p>
<p>What i&#8217;m trying to say here is we are experiencing is a paradigm shift, one from the Industrial age to the Knowledge age, wich is creating a lot of conflicts as systems are becoming obsolete, like on the process side upfront vs. more agile, management vs. leadership, etc.</p>
<p>The agile movement is one subset of the bigger scene of changes that we will be experiencing, and this won&#8217;t cease, as more and more companies, groups of people, start understanding the fundamentals of this paradigm shift, and embracing it, we will see a massive adoption of more people focused processes and systems, the economics simply will do its job, and maybe yes we will need to wait until some of the grayed guys leave, or until we may influence them, slowly but constantly.</p>
<p>On the end is really about anything that allow us to do be effective on developing software that adds value.</p>
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		<title>By: Scott</title>
		<link>http://nutrun.com/weblog/has-the-expiry-date-on-agile-just-been-set/#comment-86</link>
		<dc:creator>Scott</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Jun 2006 22:49:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://new-site.nutrun.com/?p=22#comment-86</guid>
		<description>It doesn't really matter what model is applied, they are all miss used.  Very few people I've worked with even understand how to go about  correctly developing software under a life cycle model, they all turn into cowboys in the end.  The other sad thing is everyone only seems to think that the only alternative to Agile it the waterfall model, no one is willing to read on the fundamental models (V, Spiral, etc) and then find what parts will work for them.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It doesn&#8217;t really matter what model is applied, they are all miss used.  Very few people I&#8217;ve worked with even understand how to go about  correctly developing software under a life cycle model, they all turn into cowboys in the end.  The other sad thing is everyone only seems to think that the only alternative to Agile it the waterfall model, no one is willing to read on the fundamental models (V, Spiral, etc) and then find what parts will work for them.</p>
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		<title>By: Ravi Ramachandra</title>
		<link>http://nutrun.com/weblog/has-the-expiry-date-on-agile-just-been-set/#comment-87</link>
		<dc:creator>Ravi Ramachandra</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 Jun 2006 03:41:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://new-site.nutrun.com/?p=22#comment-87</guid>
		<description>Software projects do not resemble manufacturing process and have lot of process dynamics involved even in same domain.

There needs to be set of core set of lifecyle practices, procedures in an organization and each project depending on its size, nature, circumstances should draw/customize a process from its environment.

I feel there is no magic formula that works for all situation and for all projects and companies.

Project planning and strategy needs to mature higher to custom define process for any initiative.   Process/software engineering should mature to provide such assets and environment.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Software projects do not resemble manufacturing process and have lot of process dynamics involved even in same domain.</p>
<p>There needs to be set of core set of lifecyle practices, procedures in an organization and each project depending on its size, nature, circumstances should draw/customize a process from its environment.</p>
<p>I feel there is no magic formula that works for all situation and for all projects and companies.</p>
<p>Project planning and strategy needs to mature higher to custom define process for any initiative.   Process/software engineering should mature to provide such assets and environment.</p>
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		<title>By: apps</title>
		<link>http://nutrun.com/weblog/has-the-expiry-date-on-agile-just-been-set/#comment-85</link>
		<dc:creator>apps</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 22 Jun 2006 09:33:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://new-site.nutrun.com/?p=22#comment-85</guid>
		<description>I belive all these processes are more or less same. It's depends on how best we implement the requirements in a project to deliver good software.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I belive all these processes are more or less same. It&#8217;s depends on how best we implement the requirements in a project to deliver good software.</p>
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		<title>By: Paul</title>
		<link>http://nutrun.com/weblog/has-the-expiry-date-on-agile-just-been-set/#comment-84</link>
		<dc:creator>Paul</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Jun 2006 21:31:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://new-site.nutrun.com/?p=22#comment-84</guid>
		<description>Lean Software Development is just &lt;a&gt;Six Sigma&lt;/a&gt; applied to software development.
Analyze and Measure the process.  Make a decision to fix (DMAIC) or replace (DMADV).  Improve your process.  Repeat.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Lean Software Development is just <a>Six Sigma</a> applied to software development.<br />
Analyze and Measure the process.  Make a decision to fix (DMAIC) or replace (DMADV).  Improve your process.  Repeat.</p>
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		<title>By: Deb</title>
		<link>http://nutrun.com/weblog/has-the-expiry-date-on-agile-just-been-set/#comment-83</link>
		<dc:creator>Deb</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Jun 2006 04:45:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://new-site.nutrun.com/?p=22#comment-83</guid>
		<description>Being evolved from Manufacturing side, Lean is process oriented; emphasizes on process cycle efficiency. Agile focusses on individual and interactions while able to respond to changes.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Being evolved from Manufacturing side, Lean is process oriented; emphasizes on process cycle efficiency. Agile focusses on individual and interactions while able to respond to changes.</p>
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